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Shellac and peeling/broken nails
11-05-2011, 06:15 PM
Post: #1
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Shellac and peeling/broken nails
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Surely Im not the only one having problems with this. Seems like everyone on shellac is having nails breaking and peeling. Convinced its all the soaking in acetone. Im using the shellac wraps, hands down wraps or foil/cotton method then having clients wash hands immediatly after removing shellac. Ive been grilling clients on solaroil use and keeping their nails shorter but it doesnt matter. Thinking of using the efile mentioned in another post.
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11-05-2011, 09:31 PM
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Hmmmm i am interested in what others say about this cuz i really only have 1 client -- who is an older woman....and she seems to think that her nails are getting brittle. I certainly hope this isnt the case bcuz i dont want to use my drill. I love the foil/cotton method. But if Doug is so anal about every little thing--- he researches and researches to get the most informative facts-- why wouldnt CND put a warning with their system about over usage of the acetone?? Just curious is all...thanks Wink

" Take time.....to be kind".....
Angel
~Tracy~
Full Time Nail Artist
Akron, OH
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11-05-2011, 10:26 PM
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Majority of my client's nails are doing great and in fact they are getting some length and nails are getting stronger. Now mind you, there is an ocassional nail break, but nothing continuous and often with all of them. Need to add that some of my clients have been getting Shellac for over a year now.

Is this happening to every single one of your clients Jennie? If not, did they have this issue before? Are their nails naturally strong and healthy? How long are their nails? Just shooting out some questions to see if there could be another reason.

The weather is turning colder and I do feel that nails are affected by the cold. Could that be the issue for your clients?

I would think if it is the acetone creating the problem then every nail tech using this type of removal would have this issue with every single client.
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11-05-2011, 11:00 PM
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I have not used gel polish yet. I only do natural nail manicures and pedicures. I have been looking into doing gel polish like Shellac or others. I wanted to get more info before I jumped in. I have had two clients of mine that had Shellac on their nails from other salons say that they feel their nails became very dry, brittle, peeling and cracking. I am not sure if I want to start this on my clients. I had one client report back to me on how it worked long term and she said that she started getting peeling and cracking. She used solar oil. I am looking forward to what others have to say.
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11-06-2011, 08:36 AM
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I had 2 clients in yesterday, one I suspect was very rough on her nails and not using her solar oil. She was one that could never keep acrylics on as well. The other had longer beautiful natural nails, and now has a lot of peeling. It has to be this colder weather!
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11-06-2011, 10:55 AM
Post: #6
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simplyspoiledone :
> I have not used gel polish yet. I only do natural nail manicures and pedicures.
> I have been looking into doing gel polish like Shellac or others. I wanted
> to get more info before I jumped in. I have had two clients of mine that had
> Shellac on their nails from other salons say that they feel their nails became
> very dry, brittle, peeling and cracking. I am not sure if I want to start
> this on my clients. I had one client report back to me on how it worked long
> term and she said that she started getting peeling and cracking. She used
> solar oil. I am looking forward to what others have to say.


It is easy to blame the product, but you don't know what the nail tech was doing in prep, etc. Sometimes it is the nail tech that causes these issues. But there are also other reasons this could happen; health, stress, weather, etc. So it may not be just because of the product.
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11-06-2011, 12:45 PM
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Well I happen to know Im doing all my prep step for step as Holly instructed and having a lot issues with it now a year and a half later. Many times I can blame myself for somethings with nails, but this is one thing Im sure its either the acteone or the clients.
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11-06-2011, 01:21 PM
Post: #8
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It has to be the acetone, what else are we using that repeatedly sucks the moisture out of the nail plate? When I have this happen, I ask the client to go nekid for 7-10 days using oil only, no nail polish or SOGP of any kind. It takes care of it and we go back to service as usual. It's just one week that they can go natural looking with a high shine buffing, so the oil can really work its magic.
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11-06-2011, 01:28 PM
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Jennie, I'm confused. First you said all your clients were having the issue and then you said a couple were. Have you tried filing off the gel polish and see if that helps? That may give you some idea.

All I can say with any certainty is if it was the product EVERYONE would be having the same problem. I've been using Shellac since it came out and am not having the same problem. Most if my clients nails are getting stronger and healthier than they ever have been.
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11-07-2011, 01:48 PM
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I am going to come to my own conclusion about the white spots, the dryness, the peeling and brittle nails that seems to happen with Shellac. As someone here has said several times, ( I don't really know if it does ) Shellac is the only brand that allows the nails moisture to evaporate through the product. So if we keep soaking the nails in acetone for removal, which is drying as we can see visually, then we apply Shellac and it doesn't hold any moisture to the nail, I say this is allowing it to stay dried out. If you oil then it will penetrate the shellac as it does with every sogp so you can hydrate the nail but if shellac has a difficult time holding the oils in, then I say shellac is the reason the nails are dry. I dont know if its the case but I am putting all the issues and information from all the threads together to decide this is what I think.
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11-07-2011, 02:16 PM
Post: #11
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sobeit :
> It has to be the acetone, what else are we using that repeatedly sucks the
> moisture out of the nail plate?


So now it's Shellac that is drying out their nails? If Shellac was drying out the nails it would happen to EVERYONE. It isn't!! Initially I did say it was the ONLY product that doesn't trap moisture because it was, but there are now several polish/gel combined gel polishes out there, so saying it is the only one is not a correct statement now. In the last few post I haven't said it was the ONLY one. So please quite twisting/turning my words around. TY
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11-07-2011, 02:38 PM
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Hi All,
I've read these comments and have some information for you. In my opinion, the problems that people are reporting with Shellac are not from exposure to acetone. If the removal directions are followed properly, these issues can be avoided. It takes 10 min. to soften the coating enough for proper removal... not 5 min. or 7 min.... 10 FULL min. Don't try to estimate or guess at 10 min., this should be timed with a timer. Why? Ask someone to close their eyes for 2 min. and raise their hands when 2 min. has passed. I've done this recently and most people raise their hand within the first minute. You can't guess at 10 min., this must be timed!

What can happen if less than 10 min. is used? White spots! Why? Two reasons: first, the coating hasn't been softened enough for easy removal, so nail technicians scrape the product from the natural nail.

In the last episode of Doug Schoon's Brain, I showed 3D images of what happens when this is done. The uppermost surface of the nail develops microscopic gouges that give a whitish appearance. When examined under high magnification it becomes clear that such spots are caused by scraping, even when a wooden pusher is used, so imagine what a metal scraper can do when wielded by impatient hands.

Secondly, under high magnification it's easy to see that not all the product is being removed from the nail plate. Small islands of product are left behind in thin layers. These also look like white spots on the surface.

As SimplySpoiledOne correctly stated, "it's easy to blame the product". This is why I did the last Doug Schoon's Brain episode, so that people would understand that it is important to take the time to properly and carefully remove any type of products, including Shellac.

I know "time is money", but my research has shown that "impatience causes nail damage". That's something that everyone should carefully consider before attempting to remove any product from the natural nail, including nail polish, UV gels and liquid/powder.

Improper removal has always been a problem, at least for as long as I've been in the industry. Don't let that problem happened to you and/or your clients.

Doug Schoon
Chief Scientific Adviser
Creative Nail Design, Inc.
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11-07-2011, 02:54 PM
Post: #13
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I have always been told that acetone was one of the safest chemicals we can use. I think I read this in Doug Shoon's book; please correct me if I am mistaken, Doug.
I know acetone is drying. But have you ever noticed a bowl that you have left acetone in? It has a white film in it. Anything I have ever seen where acetone has evaporated, has white on it. So naturally fingers will. To stop this, you can rub a bit of oil or hand cream or even petroleum jelly on the skin. I feel that normal use of acetone, although, drying, is not as bad as some are making it out to be. Just another consideration.
First it was product remover, UV lamps, then LED lamps, and now acetone..........is someone trying to sabotage the nail industry?

Always be kind....you get farther.
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11-07-2011, 03:30 PM
Post: #14
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Well here is something i do that ive shared before. I always do a complete dry mani b4 any reapplication. But i do go a step further and after i do all my cuticle work i buff solar oil into the nails with a gold buffer block. The nails look sooo good after i do this. Then they go scrub and the Shellac process begins. This always has worked for me and NO--- it is not all of my clients...actually just one. As i say again. Shellac is wonderful and i am very impressed with it I always push it on new clients. Honestly ive never been " blown away" by anytg CND has put out..( no offense).. but Shellac is awesome and it works. One of my clients had really bad bitten nails and now they are long and beautiful!!!! All due to Shellac!!! I talked her into trying it and promised-- promised her if she wld be patient that her nails wld grow. And they have. And she is a believer now!! Its an amazing product and im so appreciative that they came out with such a wonderful system that really does what it claims!!! Thanks CND !!! Smile

" Take time.....to be kind".....
Angel
~Tracy~
Full Time Nail Artist
Akron, OH
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11-07-2011, 03:32 PM
Post: #15
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Hi Jennie and Sobiet,
If you evaporate pure acetone, there should be no film or residual left behind. Acetone itself should leave no residue. The "white" stuff you are seeing is dissolved product from the removal process. Also, I don't recommend removing Shellac in a bowl, I recommend following CND's procedures. Also, if this were being caused by acetone pulling moisture from the nail plate, it's not very likely there would be white spots... I'd expect that most of the nail would be white, not just a few spots.

Doug Schoon
Chief Scientific Adviser
Creative Nail Design, Inc.
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11-07-2011, 03:44 PM
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Hi Tracy,
One reason you're probably impressed with Shellac is because of the tremendous amount of research that went into developing the product. This is no "me too" product.

The original concept was developed by myself and Danielle Devine (CND Education Manager), well over five years ago. I managed the research for the first two years, until I left to start my own consulting company. The two chemists working with me at the time finished the project and in my view, did an outstanding job. Great products take a lot of research and effort to develop, which is why the copy cat products are never as good. The "me to" products get rushed to market, hoping to capitalize on the success of the better designed products.

Doug Schoon
Chief Scientific Adviser
Creative Nail Design, Inc.
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11-07-2011, 03:57 PM
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Well Mr. Schoon I love the product and I do know that alot of research has gone into developing it. I mean no disrespect when saying nothing has blown me away..... just products from a bunch of diff companies have "claimed" to do this and that..but often never do. So honestly at first i did hold my breath when i started using it. But no more!! Thanks for giving the professional the tool to make more money and to truly help our clients with their nails!!

" Take time.....to be kind".....
Angel
~Tracy~
Full Time Nail Artist
Akron, OH
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11-07-2011, 04:09 PM
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I , too, appreciate your time and effort Doug and CND in producing a great gel polish line that looks just like polish but protects our clients nails. Sure has brought me a lot of new business. Kudos to a terrrrrific product!!
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11-07-2011, 08:17 PM
Post: #19
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Quote:sobeit :
> I am going to come to my own conclusion about the white spots, the dryness the peeling and brittle nails that seems to happen with Shellac. [b]
As
> someone here has said several times, ( I don't really know if it does ) Shellac
> is the only
brand that allows the nails moisture to evaporate through
> the product. So if we keep soaking the nails in acetone for removal, which
> is drying as we can see visually, then we apply Shellac and it doesn't hold
> any moisture to the nail, I say this is allowing it to stay dried out.[/b] If you
> oil then it will penetrate the shellac as it does with every sogp so you can
> hydrate the nail but if shellac has a difficult time holding the oils in, then
> I say shellac is the reason the nails are dry. I dont know if its the case
> but I am putting all the issues and information from all the threads together
> to decide this is what I think.
I am not contradicting myself, merely changing my dang mind based on the above!
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11-09-2011, 02:33 AM
Post: #20
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shellac
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i havent had any problem after getting the correct cnd light, unless they are pickers not our problem. use the cnd remover,love this product and on toes lasts a lot longer than 14 days my toe nails have ridges this has been the only product i have used on toes ridges are totally gone. have had this last polish on since the end of aug they are just now needing trimed and done again very happy with this after i got the new light.
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11-09-2011, 04:40 PM
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idonls :
> sobeit :
>> It has to be the acetone, what else are we using that repeatedly sucks the
>> moisture out of the nail plate?
>
>
> So now it's Shellac that is drying out their nails? If Shellac was drying
> out the nails it would happen to EVERYONE. It isn't!! Initially I did say
> it was the ONLY product that doesn't trap moisture because it was, but there
> are now several polish/gel combined gel polishes out there, so saying it is
> the only one is not a correct statement now. In the last few post I haven't
> said it was the ONLY one. So please quite twisting/turning my words around.
> TY




Idonls, why do you think she (sobeit) was referring to your post? Sincerely confused by your response.

Anna
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11-10-2011, 12:26 PM
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I have been guilty of being too impatient when soaking off. The next time I soak off Shellac, I will wait the whole 10 minutes and see how it goes. Unless it's a French. Honestly, the clear colors really do soak off faster, and I don't have to scrape or buff or anything, they just come off. Big Grin But okay, I'll wait ten minutes for them too. Big Grin Big Grin

Elyse in WA
http://www.elysiumnailstudio.com
The Nail Princess is in.
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11-10-2011, 12:33 PM
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I am a little confused about the white spots. Here is why. I have a client who gets them after several months of using nail polish. There is no removal other than rubbing with a hands down nail wipe and polish remover. They are spots that go away when oil is applied. We go polish free for no less than 7 days and use oil daily, the spots go away, nails are all hydrated and back to polish we go. It takes months for them to get dry again in the spots and its usually on the ring and pinky fingers.
This is why I equated it to the acetone which I am told is not the case, its the pushing, so what about this client of mine? Her nails don't flake, the cuticle and surrounding tissue don't react like an allergy, there is no lifting of the nail bed. just dry spots.
I haven't heard of other lines causing the white spot complaint, and Shellac is reported to be easier to soak than others. I find Polish Pro to be the best at removal. It will often fall right off in the bowl or wrap, leaving a little piece here and there to push off.
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11-10-2011, 12:59 PM
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sobeit :
> I am a little confused about the white spots. Here is why. I have a client
> who gets them after several months of using nail polish. There is no removal
> other than rubbing with a hands down nail wipe and polish remover. They are
> spots that go away when oil is applied.





I am with you on this as I see this with big toes. Again, the spots disappear with oil is applied or if the nail is lightly buffed. I don't use gels of any kind on toes at this juncture.

Anna
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11-10-2011, 08:38 PM
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Nail Raising :
> idonls :
>> sobeit :
>>> It has to be the acetone, what else are we using that repeatedly sucks the
>>> moisture out of the nail plate?
>>
>>
>> So now it's Shellac that is drying out their nails? If Shellac was drying
>> out the nails it would happen to EVERYONE. It isn't!! Initially I did say
>> it was the ONLY product that doesn't trap moisture because it was, but there
>> are now several polish/gel combined gel polishes out there, so saying it is
>> the only one is not a correct statement now. In the last few post I haven't
>> said it was the ONLY one. So please quite twisting/turning my words around.
>> TY
>
>
>
>
> Idonls, why do you think she (sobeit) was referring to your post? Sincerely
> confused by your response.


Anna, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. I didn't see your comment til today. I wasn't referring to the quote from Sobeit that you copied. I was referring to one that she had made about how Shellac may not be holding moisture onto the nail that we apply i.e. cuticle oil, lotions or our natural oils, etc. That isn't the case at all. Shellac allows moisture to evaporate from our nails that come from our bodies (unlike nail enhancements and some gel polishes). That doesn't mean that when we apply moisture it won't penetrate Shellac or that Shellac dries that moisture out. I do feel that there are some people that are excessively dry and no matter what you use on them they are dry, nails are dry, skin is dry, etc. My clients have no dry, brittle nails after having Shellac applied to their nails for about a year and half. If Shellac was drying out nails or moisture we apply not penetrating or able to get to their natural nail, then everyone would be having the issue, not a few. I hope this clarifies everything for you. Thank you for asking.
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