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The spa owner wants me to.... CLIP CUTICLES!!
#1
CLIP CUTICLES!!

I have told her NYS does not allow this & explained why it is not good to do this. Another employee also told her why I should not do this. She likes it done on her & that is why she is pushing me. Plus, she just hired a new nail tech that has been working for the past 6 mths at a umm..how do i say it nicely and not get in trouble?....well, you get the idea.

This new girl has been licensed in coz for two years, but decided last year she liked nails better. I am a licensed nail tech, have worked in this industry for 8 yrs. I'm also a licensed esthetician and recently through Goldwell took the Allpersan course with Donald Green and am also a CMP (Certified Master Pedicurist). With all this under my belt my boss tells me at least twice a week (I work only 4 days) that I'm going to learn a lot from this new girl.

I have other beef's with this boss, but this one is more important to me. I'm looking for advise on this please. Just this week she changed how the pedicures are done...took out some steps & added others...and what I am now supposed to do is ASK the client if they want their cuticles pushed back or clipped...giving the client the option. Hello....isn't this still MY license on the line here if something happens?

Please advise,
Mary Ellen in NY
#2
I am very new to doing nails, but I would not clip cuticles either, I had a lady from New York just about cuss me out because she wanted me to clip her cuticles, she even grabbed my file after telling me where to go and started to tear her cuticles off with my purifile. She says that in NY they clip them and this is what she wanted, well in Georgia we are told and taught not to and I understand why, so I dont do it . I think I would have to explain to the owner and the new person that it shouldnt be done and why, maybe you could show them some infections that have been caused by doing it? Maybe google some stuff to show them.
#3
That's a thought, thanks, but I have turned blue explaining..so has fellow co-workers...her mind is made up. She follows no sanitation proceedures at all in the nail department, so I guess I shouldn't be so suprised by this. SHE DOESN'T ALLOW US TO THROW AWAY ORANGE WOOD STICKS

And what's up with your client saying that we do that in NY??!!! She obviously puts cost above safety and only goes to techs that do not follow NYS laws!!
#4
I go around to differant nail places in the Metro Atlanta area just to check out what they have, their set up, and just to snoop actually, well they where using a purifile to file off the ends of their orange wood sticks, and they also used one to clean off their white blocks, they where using them over but I dont know for how long, this place only did mani/pedi, they did not do acrylics, and they where not a chop shop. I was surprised, it is a very upscale place, I had even entertained the idea of working there for a bit, until I got the job I am in now.
#5
I personally clip cuticles but only when it is necessary. I apply a cuticle remover, push back cuticles and then wipe off the cuticle with a towel. Anything still attached does get clipped. But never living tissue.

As long as the final result is clean and tidy with an immaculate polish job than you stick by your guns. It seems like it might be time to have a sit down with your salon owner and bring with you information about sanitation procedures that are being ignored. By showing her printed materials maybe she will understand it's not just what you want, it's what is necessary to run a quality salon (especially about the orangewood sticks Confusedhock: ).

You do have something to learn from this new tech. Although you are definitely more educated and experienced, new people always bring new ideas and a fresh perspective. And even though it may not be right for you, it's nice to learn new ways of doing things. But I would flat out ask her what she means by mentioning all the time that you have something to learn from this new tech. It sounds like she's beating around the bush at something.

Trust your instincts.
Anna Elliott
[email protected]
#6
*~* Just went thru this as well w/a client the other day. She said "well don't you clip cuticles - other places I've gone do". I explained to her I personally choose whether "I" think it's necessary (obvious etc.) but otherwise I don't. She was pointing out a Very VERY tiny bit and I explained if I were to Clip and get some live tissue it could cause irritation, hangnails etc. :roll: So with (as stated) a good cuticle remover, gentle pushing back etc. I think it's alot better JMO. Then she admitted that she's had problems in the past of girls Clipping too close and then she'd end up with irritated cuticles :?
________
Jaguar R5
#7
I believe you need to go to the state site and print out the law for her Smile


http://www.dos.state.ny.us/lcns/lawbooks/app_enh.html
§160.11 Owner responsibilities
(a) An owner, an area renter or both shall be responsible for the proper conduct of the licensed business and for the proper provision of appearance enhancement services to the public by its employees or operators.
(b) An owner, an area renter or both shall be responsible for compliance with all applicable health and sanitary codes, and all statutory and regulatory requirements with respect to the practices of the occupation and business prescribed by this Part.

(2) After each client use, electric razor heads, cuticle scissors, and other implements which may abrade or clip superficial layers of skin shall be cleaned with warm water and soap or detergent, rinsed thoroughly, dried with clean toweling or other material, and completely immersed in an EPA approved hospital grade disinfectant in accordance with manufacturers' recommendations for the implement, and no less than 10 minutes. Following disinfection, the implement shall be rinsed, dried, and stored in a drawer, cabinet or covered container.
(3) Implements that are intended to penetrate skin or enter pores shall be either single use disposable or subject to sterilization. Implements that will be reused shall be thoroughly cleaned with warm water and soap or a detergent, rinsed and sterilized after each client use. Implements that will be autoclaved shall be packaged prior to sterilization.


From NY's Consumer Guideline pamphlet:
• Porous manicuring and waxing implements such as emery boards, block buffers and waxing sticks and other implements that cannot be disinfected should not be used for more than one person.

Our law (I am NY also) does not specifically state no cuticle cutting.. but this comes into the same category as "blades" one oops and you have an infection that could lead to a law suit.. I think you need to call Albany to clarify this..
E-mail: [email protected]
Telephone: (518) 474-4429

Superficial definition:
1. being at, on, or near the surface: a superficial wound.
2. of or pertaining to the surface: superficial measurement.
3. external or outward: a superficial resemblance.

This does not allow us to cut LIVE skin.. something that is standing up and waving at you yes.. remove the NON-live tissue that is adhered to the nail yes, but not live skin.
Regards,
Debbie webmaster - admin
BeautyTech.com Feed Your Nail Addiction
NailTech.com shop smart, brand name professional products for professional results

#8
:roll: AMEN!
________
glass bongs
#9
Wow, ladies...that's some powerful info and I thank you!

And I guess in the heat of the moment I should have clarified that I understand that (and I like it phrased as) if it's standing up and waving at me...it's outta there. The owner, during pedicures, wishes for the entire cuticle..side wall to side wall..all the way around the nail plate...to be clipped clean & neat...that's how she's had it done and that's how she likes it. And that is precisely why I gots a problem with it!!

Thanks again for all your support. Oh, and yes, new faces do bring fresh ideas to the table, but the boss has already placed the new girl up on a pedi-stool (sorry, couldn't resist the pun) because she's coming from a NSS & has experience in doing this technique that the boss likes so well. During the last pedicure I gave the boss, she asked me how long it took me to do a pedicure. I thought it an odd question, but let her know that I was performing well within the time frame they were scheduled for (1hr). She replies to me "Well, Michelle can do a pedicure in 1/2hr". I didn't say too much after that.

Enough...but GOOD NEWS!! I was approached with a job offer at another spa. I will attempt to bring conclusion to these issues with my current boss, but if it isn't possible I'll be okay Big Grin

Thank again all
#10
You and your employer are, how can I say it, unequaly yoked. You will never be happy working for someone who doesn't share the same values as you. Speed v. quality, sanitation v. cost, etc...

I guess every expirience is a learning expirience. At your next interveiw you'll know what type of questions to ask, and what sort of values to look for. Always remember that you'll never go wrong when you are being right!
Crazy in l Heart ve with Cuccio!
#11
I just finished school and they do teach to only clip what is dead. Now, my question to them was what about the cuticle that grows over the nail, should it be pushed back and whatever is sticking up, even tho it isn't white, be clipped? I was told by 2 teachers no, but another teacher said, "whatever is lifted you can clip." Leaving me more confused. Thanks for putting in the NYS law, it did help. I guess I was just confused on the "white" and what is sticking up. I'm so glad that I found this site!
#12
I think the biggest confusion is the term "cuticle"


There was a great thread that I wanted to refer you to but can;t find it this instant.. I'll find it and let you know...
Regards,
Debbie webmaster - admin
BeautyTech.com Feed Your Nail Addiction
NailTech.com shop smart, brand name professional products for professional results

#13
Alrighty then It took me a bit but I grabbed it and I will "sticky" this one now so it does not get gone Smile

I have several clients that have a serious cuticle growth problem. I know there are techs out there who absolutely refuse to clip the cuticle--I don't subscribe to that theory, but at the same time it isn't always necessary.

While prepping for artificial surfaces I always ALWAYS push back the cuticle--you can often times reveal at least 1/8 to 1/4 inch of nail growth that needs to be dealt with. If you don't, you may not like the results.

Cuticle growth is the worst for 1st timers, or people who generally neglect the care of their hands. But after awhile, with regular care and proper maintenance, you can control it to some degree. But for artificial services, I always push the cuticle back--I may not always nip, but it's always pushed.

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I've found that a maginfying glass works wonders to be able to see all the stuff left behind after doing what was thought of as a good prep job! I've got the kind that mounts right on to my desk, I think it's a 5 power with a flourescent bulb encircling it. Or a simple hand help glass will work just as well. The stuff we can't see can cause problems, too.

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I push all the cuticles back and take the side of my nippers and scrape very gently all around the nail at the cuticle to remove any debrie. You wouldn't believe all the junk that comes off! LOL! then if there is anything hanging I cut it off so I don't catch my file on it and make it worse. Other than that, I don't really nip cuticles.

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I do what ever I need to do to make the nails look beautiful. I always use cuticle eliminator and push them back, if something is sticking out and screaming "cut me"!! I will nip it right off. It's all about the prep and having nothing to interfere with the adhesion of the acrylic or gel.

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One way pathogens enter the body during a nail service is to cut or tear living tissue. The eponychium (sp) is just that - living epidermis tissue. As professionals we need to keep this area intact. This protects the nail bed from pathogens.

The 'cuticle' is the non living stuff that is whitish in appearence under the eponychium - adhered to the nail plate or is sticking up and along the nail folds.

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ok, after reading all of this, I just can't help myself, if the cuticle is the dead white stuff, what is the pterygium?

I believe wikipedia says, In human anatomy, the cuticle refers to the fold of skin at the proximal end of the fingernail; see eponychium.

The eponychium or cuticle in human anatomy refers to the thickened layer of skin surrounding fingernails and toenails. The function is to protect the area between the nail and epidermis from exposure to harmful bacteria. Beneath the cuticle is a thin layer of pterygium.

I am being funny/silly, for the record. giggle. I just couldn't help it, it is so silly to be even discussing this when we ALL are PROFESSIONALS.

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http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v22/Sh...rygium.jpg

Just wanted to also add that a pterygium stone is used to push back and remove cuticle, NOT pterygium. The name is misleading I know....

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Pterygium is an adhesion of the proximal nail fold to the proximal nail bed following inflammation that destroys the nail matrix. Scar formation may occur, leading to partial loss of the nail plate. Pterygium occurs almost exclusively with lichen planus.

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OK I'm going to jump in here.. this exact topic was just discussed on the mailing list, where many long time techs admitted to using the wrong terminology.. the topic started because many attended Doug Schoon's seminar in Orlando and he begged us to use the proper terminology to help raise our level of acceptance in the industry and elsewhere..

Cuticle is dead skin

It is not the live tissue surrounding the top of the nail plate covering the matrix area

Nipping or cutting of live skin is either prohibited by your state laws or "outside the scope of practice"

If the client has an abundance of CUTICLE on the nail PLATE, then you need to use a quality cuticle remover such as Blue Cross or Prolinc and use the proper tools.. nippers are not for this purpose.. nippers should only be used to clip hangnails or anything "standing up and waving", trimming the eponychium is asking for trouble -- you could cause the client to bleed, break the protective seal and the matrix can become infected, there are dozens of reasons.. This has not nothing to do with looking down on anyone, or "antiquated" practices, it is a legal and health issue. Just because your laws do not specifically state not to cut cuticles (which in itself is wrong terminology) if you are trimming the eponychium - that is live skin and that practice is "outside the scope of practice" That clause is in every state's law somewhere..

Personally I believe that trimming of the eponychium will cause it to grow back thicker.. much like trimming callus back too far.. both are there for a reason, when you remove it the body say "oh no I need more protection in that area" and regenerates growth thicker to protect. Years ago I used to cut/trim my "cuticles" and I noticed they got thicker and thicker, harder, so I stopped and started to use remover and now I do not have this problem any more.

None of us or anyone on this earth is ever too smart to not learn something every day. Just because we have always used the wrong terminology (such as nail mold) does not make it right, it means we need to ALL get with the times, use proper terms, make us true professionals and raise our level of recognition as something beyond the gum snapping manicurist who can't get a job doing anything else. If any of you read my newsletter that went out today you can read for yourself how much I learned last weekend at Orlando, and how much my husband learned. I have been in this business for 16 years..

Courtesy of Nail Structure and Product Chemistry, Doug Schoon, Creative Nail Design, Milady Publishing

Over the years, much confusion has been caused by a misunderstanding of nail anatomy. Some state regulations tell students they can't cut the cuticles, when really they mean the living tissue of the eponychium. Cutting the fold can break the seal and lead to infection. These regulations aren't meant to prevent you from cleaning the nonliving tissue (cuticle) from the nail plate.

Clearly, the confusion can be avoided if we teach clients about the anatomy of the natural nail. While they are marveling at your knowledge, you will be helping eliminate the confusion. And you'll be making a positive contribution to our industry.

The word cuticle is loosely and often incorrectly used. Ask clients to point to their cuticle and they'll most likely point vaguely to the skin at the base of the nail plate-the visible part of the living eponychium-instead of the nonliving tissue that adheres to the nail plate. How did this misconception get started? Surprisingly, it probably started because of some medical text. These few references often simply state that the cuticle is the eponychium, without explaining to the reader that the cuticle sheds from the underside of the eponychium. But the cuticle is only a part of the eponychium. In fact, it is found on the underside of the eponychium, where the tissue sits against the newly forming nail plate. This tissue sticks very tightly to the freshly made nail plate. The tissue binds so tightly that the growing nail plate pulls off a thin layer and drags it along. In other words, the detached tissue "rides" on the nail plate, seeming to grow from under the edge of the nail fold. This thin layer of colorless tissue is the cuticle, the dead tissue on the nail plate, not the living tissue that surrounds the nail plate. In the cross section shown in Figure 1-3, the cuticle can be seen separating from the underside of the eponychium. The underside of the eponychium is constantly shedding thin layers of this colorless tissue. As this shed skin emerges with the nail plate it creates one of the most important of the four nail plate guardian seals.

During a properly performed manicure, the eponychium is gently pushed back to expose the cuticle. The cuticle must be carefully removed. Improperly performed, this part of the manicure can cause problems for clients. For example, applying artificial nail products over this thin layer of skin will prevent proper adhesion, causing the artificial nail to separate and lift from the surface of the natural nail plate. Many hours of valuable time are lost to repairs made necessary by careless removal of the cuticle. Not only can improperly removing the cuticle contribute to artificial nail service breakdown, it can also lead to infection or nail deformities. This is why it is very important to avoid removing cuticle from underneath the nail fold. It is fine to push back the eponychium first, but do not place any instrument underneath the nail fold itself. This can lead to injury and infection ...

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In short there should be no comparison here if all you are doing is clipping hang nails and "wavers". If you are cutting live skin/tissue then let me know so I can report you to your board :wink: There is FAR more chance of breaking live tissue with a blade than with nippers, far more permanent damage can happen from that cut.. that is not to say a nicked cuticle has *never* developed into a full blown serious infection, it is just the odds would be way lower of a cuticle nick getting serious than a slice of a blade.
Regards,
Debbie webmaster - admin
BeautyTech.com Feed Your Nail Addiction
NailTech.com shop smart, brand name professional products for professional results

#14
Most of my clients...the 1st thing they say is.... i don't care what color polish, I just need my cuticles really worked on.

After the service....every client looks at their fingertips in amazement and exclaims how great they look!

1st they go to the sink and do a sugar scrub. Then we sit down. I apply cuticle eliminator...I apply it with my own finger and rub it all along the cuticle and sidewalls...I have seen techs dot it on from the bottle and not rub it in at all, so what does that accomplish?

I file the free edge then do the hand and arm massage while the culticle eliminator is "processing"... I have seen many techs put on the cuticle eliminator and jump right into pushing the cuticle...what is that accomplishing?


Then I push the cuticles and buff the nails. The buffing also gets rid of alot of "cuticle/pterygium/nonliving tissue". Then I apply solar oil. If I can still see things waving at that point, they get cut off.


Frequently people say that the reason my manicures are so good is that I dont cut cuticles. If somebody does happen to want their eponychium, that they are refering to as cutile cut, they get to hear the speech about preventing pathogens and growing back harder and so on.
Whoever said orange was the new pink was seriously disturbed!

http://www.thefrenchmanicurist.com
#15
I just want to say thank you so very much for all the information, it is great stuff and eliminates my confusion. HaHaHa.....now on to other confusing topics....lol.....thanks everyone.....have a great day!

Remember to smile, it shows your inner beauty

Stephanie
#16
medunham2 :
> CLIP CUTICLES!!
>
> I have told her NYS does not allow this & explained why it is not good
> to do this. Another employee also told her why I should not do this. She
> likes it done on her & that is why she is pushing me. Plus, she just hired
> a new nail tech that has been working for the past 6 mths at a umm..how do
> i say it nicely and not get in trouble?....well, you get the idea.
>
> This new girl has been licensed in coz for two years, but decided last year
> she liked nails better. I am a licensed nail tech, have worked in this industry
> for 8 yrs. I'm also a licensed esthetician and recently through Goldwell took
> the Allpersan course with Donald Green and am also a CMP (Certified Master
> Pedicurist). With all this under my belt my boss tells me at least twice a
> week (I work only 4 days) that I'm going to learn a lot from this new girl.
>
>
> I have other beef's with this boss, but this one is more important to me.
> I'm looking for advise on this please. Just this week she changed how the
> pedicures are done...took out some steps & added others...and what I am
> now supposed to do is ASK the client if they want their cuticles pushed back
> or clipped...giving the client the option. Hello....isn't this still MY license
> on the line here if something happens?
>
> Please advise,
> Mary Ellen in NY
Hi Mary

Cure for 2 – 3 minutes. Remove sticky surface with a clean lint free square saturated in Gel Cleaner.

 
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